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The Holy Bible - An interesting Read

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#1
Fatony

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salam All,
There is nothing in our religion that suggests that we do not learn from other holy books. However, as you know; The Holy Bible has been distorted and changed, but today there are still copies existing in Palestine of the early Deciples that Followed Eissa (Jesus) PBUH and were later muted.

One of these people is King James, a close bretheren of Jesus PBUH . The Holy Bible of King James is the closest thing you can get to the Quran , because it mentions that Jesus was nothing more than just a servant, and that he was neither divine or died on the cross.

Now, doing some googling around (as usual) I would like to share with you the beautiful story of Abraham (Ibraheem a.s.) As written in this holy bible. I will let you decide on the Similarities it has with the Quran Al Kareem.

------------------------------------
The Holy Bible: King James.

The First Book of Moses, CalledGenesis16

Hagar and Ishmael1 Now Sarai, Abram's wife, bare him no children: and she had a handmaid, an Egyptian, whose name was Hagar.
2 And Sarai said unto Abram, Behold now, the LORD hath restrained me from bearing: I pray thee, go in unto my maid; it may be that I may obtain children by her. And Abram hearkened to the voice of Sarai.
3 And Sarai, Abram's wife, took Hagar her maid the Egyptian, after Abram had dwelt ten years in the land of Canaan, and gave her to her husband Abram to be his wife.
4 And he went in unto Hagar, and she conceived: and when she saw that she had conceived, her mistress was despised in her eyes.
5 And Sarai said unto Abram, My wrong be upon thee: I have given my maid into thy bosom; and when she saw that she had conceived, I was despised in her eyes: the LORD judge between me and thee.
6 But Abram said unto Sarai, Behold, thy maid is in thy hand; do to her as it pleaseth thee. And when Sarai dealt hardly with her, she fled from her face.
7 And the angel of the LORD found her by a fountain of water in the wilderness, by the fountain in the way to Shur.
8 And he said, Hagar, Sarai's maid, whence camest thou? and whither wilt thou go? And she said, I flee from the face of my mistress Sarai.
9 And the angel of the LORD said unto her, Return to thy mistress, and submit thyself under her hands.
10 And the angel of the LORD said unto her, I will multiply thy seed exceedingly, that it shall not be numbered for multitude.
11 And the angel of the LORD said unto her, Behold, thou art with child, and shalt bear a son, and shalt call his name Ish'ma-el; 8 because the LORD hath heard thy affliction.
12 And he will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man's hand against him: and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren.
13 And she called the name of the LORD that spake unto her, Thou God seest me: for she said, Have I also here looked after him that seeth me?
14 Wherefore the well was called Beerla'hairoi: 9 behold, it is between Kadesh and Bered.
15 And Hagar bare Abram a son: and Abram called his son's name, which Hagar bare, Ish'ma-el.
16 And Abram was fourscore and six years old, when Hagar bare Ish'ma-el to Abram.

Note 8. God shall hear.
Note 9. The well of him that liveth and seeth me.

Source: http://www.bartleby.com/108/01/16.html
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#2
Amina

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salam All,
There is nothing in our religion that suggests that we do not learn from other holy books.


Fatony khoya , are you sure about that ??!! what I knew before is that it is reserved olny to spacialts to look in Bible texts .. and after looking again , I found this answer




هل يجوز قراءة كتب أهل أهل الكتاب كالإنجيل مثلا؟
الفتوى

الحمد لله والصلاة والسلام على رسول الله وعلى آله وصحبه أما بعد: ‏

فقد روى أحمد والطبراني، والحاكم: أن عمر بن الخطاب جاء إلى الرسول صلى الله عليه ‏وسلم فقال: يا رسول الله إني مررت بأخ لي من بني قريظة، فكتب لي جوامع من التوراة ‏ألا أعرضها عليك؟ قال: فتغير وجه رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم. فقال عمر: ‏رضينا بالله رباً، وبالإسلام ديناً، وبمحمد صلى الله عليه وسلم رسولاً. قال: فسري عن ‏رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم، قال: والذي نفس محمد بيده. لو أصبح فيكم موسى ثم ‏اتبعتموه وتركتموني لضللتم، أنتم حظي من الأمم، وأنا حظكم من النبيين".‏
وأخرج أبو يعلى قوله صلى الله عليه وسلم: " لا تسألوا أهل الكتاب عن شيء، فإنهم لن ‏يهدوكم وقد ضلوا. إنكم إما أن تصدقوا بباطل، وإما أن تكذبوا بحق"
فعمر رضي الله ‏عنه ما جاء بصحف التوراة إلا ليقرأها ويطلع على ما فيها، فنهاه صلى الله عليه وسلم عن ‏ذلك.‏
فلا يجوز للمسلم أن يقرأ أي كتاب من الكتب السابقة ولا يطلع عليها، إلا من قرأها ‏لبيان ما ورد فيها من تحريفات وتضارب بينها، وكان من الراسخين في العلم.‏
وأما عامة المسلمين، ومن ليس لهم شأن في الرد على تحريفات وشبهات أهل الكتاب فلا ‏يجوز له قراءة التوراة والإنجيل وغيرها من الكتب السابقة.‏
والله أعلم. ‏



http://www.islamweb....t...g=A&Id=8037

I think better we saty away from other books .. and keep Quran , try to learn from it as much possible ..
,


#3
Saffron

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I think it's not bad to read books of other religions...
It's more important with what aim you are reading. I not see anything wrong to read it for knowledge, to have clear imagination about something the best way is to learn the original source. To believe or no to what you read it is different question. And i don't think that simply reading can change believing, because believing come from the heart.

Sorry, I can't find english words again to express my thought fully, hope you understand me right
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#4
^_^Chaouia^_^

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there was a bible before king james which was Matthew's Bible, also known as the Matthew Bible, was first published in 1537 under the pseudonym "Thomas Matthew". It combined Coverdale's work with the maximum of Tyndale's, and thus began the main sequence of English Bible translations. These texts are different then King James ones.

From the 800s to the 1400s, Jewish scholars today known as Masoretes compared the text of all known biblical manuscripts in an effort to create a unified, standardized text. A series of highly similar texts eventually emerged, and any of these texts are known as Masoretic Texts (MT). The Masoretes also added vowel points (called niqqud) to the text, since the original text only contained consonant letters. This sometimes required the selection of an interpretation, since some words differ only in their vowels—their meaning can vary in accordance with the vowels chosen. In antiquity, variant Hebrew readings existed, some of which have survived in the Samaritan Pentateuch, the Dead Sea scrolls, and other ancient fragments, as well as being attested in ancient versions in other languages.

so how could you compare a book that has been altered so many times? i do not feel that there is any proof of the real bible other then what has been stated in the koran, because over time each generation has changed the bible according to their society
TamattuT nnegh machi ghir i waghrom
Tattali zang u yis wa Traffed' agastur."
The shawi woman isn't just for house work
She rides the horse and carries a sword.

#5
Amina

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ooh thanks alot chaouia .. I really wanted someone to clarify and u did it ..
dear Saffron , you read from other religions when the informations are sure .. since there are many copies of the Bible , a book wich has been alterned many times .. in the other hand , there is ONE copy of Koran ( Quran) from 14 centuries .
I invite you to read the koran , and evan Ahmed Deedat books who wrote alot about this subjet.

#6
Saffron

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ooh thanks alot chaouia .. I really wanted someone to clarify and u did it ..
dear Saffron , you read from other religions when the informations are sure .. since there are many copies of the Bible , a book wich has been alterned many times .. in the other hand , there is ONE copy of Koran ( Quran) from 14 centuries .
I invite you to read the koran , and evan Ahmed Deedat books who wrote alot about this subjet.


Yes, information should to be sure, but sometime analyze different variation is interesting to, of course it take a lot of time... But if you have time why not analyze?

I'm already reading Koran, but i can't read original because i not understand arabic <_< , i have lithuanian translation, and i'm reading sometime, then have time.

#7
Fatony

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I am reading for comparison purposes and nothing more. It's amazing how similar the stories are and some are more detailed.

Sheikh Ahmed Deedat did it. He is a very successful Da'ia - caller to islam to date. I don't see where the problem is. If you are in a foreign country and you have no where to pray, it is allowed to pray in a Church... So, where is the problem.

Personally, it has not made me weak or changed my view of my religion. It has made it stronger that Allah swt has been sending his message throughout and only humans where changing it to manipulate people and make money out of it.

#8
Ithri

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Come on Fatony, unless u r one and hiding it, I don't think that we have the knowledge of Quran that Ahmad Deedat ra had before he started studying other books. and he never did it for comparison purpose but for the only reason to prove Quran is right.

There is a general concensus of muslim scholars that it is advised to "normal" ppl to avoid reading other books so they don't get confused unless they feel they have the necessary tools for analysis and they fear not their weaknesses.

I personally read the bible in different languages, but it wasn't to strengthen my faith nor anything of the like. I just felt like I had to because at that time I had some 'interesting' and unavoidable discussions with some christian ppl and had to be ready for the debates. And in addition to the books themselves I read books written by knowledgeable muslims treating of the subject in order to get the right analysis tools

Other than this reason I think it is totally useless and harmfull.
Un homme se leva et demanda permission d'appeler les fidles la prire.
Permission lui ft donne:
- Vous pouvez les appeler, tant que vous les appelez Dieu et non vous-mme.
- Mais comment saurais-je la diffrence?
- Si a vous drange que quelqu'un d'autre les appelle Dieu, c'est que vous les appelez vous-mme.

#9
^_^Chaouia^_^

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I am reading for comparison purposes and nothing more. It's amazing how similar the stories are and some are more detailed.

Sheikh Ahmed Deedat did it. He is a very successful Da'ia - caller to islam to date. I don't see where the problem is. If you are in a foreign country and you have no where to pray, it is allowed to pray in a Church... So, where is the problem.

Personally, it has not made me weak or changed my view of my religion. It has made it stronger that Allah swt has been sending his message throughout and only humans where changing it to manipulate people and make money out of it.



yes khouya but in those days Christians were practicing "el katab Allah" "the book of God" and at those times before when stated we may pray in a church they were not worshiping the profit Issa(Jesus)peace be upon him as the son of Allah as they do now. the Christian now a days pray to statues, crosses, belive that the profit Issa(Jesus) peace be upon him, is the son of God (Allah) so they make it the same as pagans which is shrik and is forbidden, how can u pray in a church with statues of saints and a statue of the profit Issa(Jesus) peace be upon him? it is againt Islam.

#10
demi

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I don't think that reading a bible or any other religious book is wrong ... like Fatony and Safron already said : It is an information more that we don't have...

I mean if we (muslims) want to discuss with the christians or any other religion , then we must know what "their holy book" says , and what they understand about it ... Of course it won't bring us from our beliefes like Saffron said ... Because Islam is the true religion and if we have this in our heart then nothing can change it. But someone who doesn't belief from his heart, this person could be manipulated by every written text ... not only from a bible ^^ ...

We can only make people thinking about their beliefs , if we know what is wrong in their beliefs .
Example : only someone who is outside our planet can see that our earth is round . Someone who is in the planet thinks that the earth is flat ... ( only if he/she isn't a genious and asks himself / herself why the ship gets more and more little when it go ... )
Or if someone make a trip around the earth and come back on the same place :D :D